YOUR COMMENTS

Part Time Volunteer fireman are NOT required to have the same traing as the full time professional career firefighers in the larger municipalities such as Conocrd, Manchester, Nashua, etc.

In most small towns, pretty much anyone can get on a volunteer fire department, no screening for drug use, no criminal record check in other states they may have resided, etc, all they have to do is show up in the evenings to hang out at the fire station for 'meetings'. Gives an excellent cover to get into houses to see what valuables they may have. Also, enables them to carry a badge that looks official.
- Steve, Derry

Public Safety Officers, police, fire, EMS and EMA, make matter of life and safety decisions based on the best available information; and don't have time to second guess Mother Nature, or misinformed and unprepared citizens. Each officer consider 3 priorities, Life and Safety, Property, and the Environment, and based on these factors, make the best decisions for all concerned. Next time you or your love one is suffering from an apparent heart attack, or your house is on fire or being robbed; who are you reliant upon and who will you call. In preparation for Hurricane Katrina, 10,000 Pet Owners refused to evaluate; many of them are included in the more than 1,500 who lost their lives. When an officer tells you to evacuate, it is not ordered without taking into account all considerations; it is done because full time, as well as volunteer officers, know more often than not; the consequences in the end. And, regarding the qualification and compentency of volunteer fire departments; I would not hesitate to put my life in their hands; each of us do that every day - too bad some are not able to recognize or appreciate that.
- David, Scarborough, Maine

God said...
It was promised the earth would never be destroyed by water again.
Helicopter story:
There was a great rain that hit the area and there was this "person" who remembered this promise (as shown above)!
The rain hit the area heavily and the person needed to move into the house. A friend came by and offered to take this person by canoe to a safe location- they refused (remebering of course the above)
Then as the rain flooded the area this person now moved to the second floor. Well another friend came by in their motor boat and said "common get in"well again they refused.
Now they are on the roof because there is no where to go. A helicopter now shows up and (you guessed it they refused)!
Well this person drowns and goes to heaven and at the gates... they questioned...Why? A (false sense of security) now I am dead? Your promise?
God said I tried to save you, I sent a canoe, a motor boat and a helicopter! Sometimes we argue over things that are just rediculous. We also cut our nose to spite our face (don't we)?
I'd like to believe that our police and fire people do a hell of a good job and get very little to NO credit. Sure we could stay in our house but how often do you hear those results prove fatal. Often times they (public servants) still risk their own lives to last minute decisions of peoples poor judgement.
I guess it should be a choice but then that would be considered your helicopter.
I consider them as knowledgable and treat them with respect. I personally would take the "helicopter ride"!
- C-J, Salem,NH

As a career Fire Chief in one of those small NH towns, I would like to clarify the issue of volunteer vs. full-time and this whole professional thing that's floating around. The "volunteer" people go through the exact same training as the "full-time" people, the standards are the same for fire training, EMS training, and emergency management training, which just to let everyone know is the division that will have command and control during these large scale natural disasters. The only difference is whether the individual is compensated or not compensated. Please thank the folks that provide these services in your communities. They are the ones venturing out at all hours of the day and night, in all sorts of weather, to help others.
- Chief Lockwood, Gilmanton

Steve - Concord:

Depsite this not involving some slickbacked "justus brutha" or the ACLU; this is a CIVIL RIGHTS issue, period. You or anyone else representing "the gov't" DO NOT HAVE THE CONSTITUTIONAL AUTHORITY to treat me as a criminal and order me off my property simply because you decide to declare "an emergency" for some such or another. You CAN however stay off my property and explain the dangers of staying here, and that I would be without immediate assistance for some time. I will listen to your arguements and make my decision then.
- Bryan, Weare, NH

Tom from Portsmouth hits the nail on the head. In many cases, the resident of the property is infinitely more competent to make the judgement decision of staying or leaving..... rather than the local volunteer / non-professional fireman or fire chief with minimal knowledge and training.

In the major cities you typically see firechiefs that are full time certified and career professionals. However in many towns you get the plumber during the day serving as the fire chief at night. Because selectmen appointed someone as fire chief not sure that qualifies him / her to make a knwoledgeable decision on whether or not residents should abandon their home, pets, valuables. I have caught volunteer fireman 'searching' through rooms of homes that were not at all an area they should have been in. I am sure there are many volunteer fireman and volunteer fire chiefs that truly want to help the community. I am equally sure that some persons get in as volunteer fire fighters for less than honorable reasons, makes a great cover to get into peoples homes in rural areas where pretty much anyone can get on as a volunteer firefighter.
- Steve, Derry

Mark, I hear what you're saying. I do. But this has nothing to do with emergency responders. This is a matter of civil rights. Residents of this state have a right to stand their ground. They have a right to stay in their homes. They have a right not to be ordered around by the government. That's the issue here. I don't want to live in a police state, but that's the type of situation we're dealing with with court decisions such as this. This is not the court's place. Safety cannot be allowed to defeat freedom. If it does, what have all the people who sacrificed their lives for this country truly accomplished?
- Alex, Nashua, NH

Steve from Derry sums up my very thoughts on this. Unless my local government has contracted out with Stephen Hawking, there is not a single decision regarding my home, property and family that any government official is more capable of making a decision for then me. I am thoroughly disappointed by the hew and cry for a government binky to arbitrarily decide what is in my best interests.
- JB, NB, NH

As much as I respect law enforcement and our fire fighters this is one law I will ignore if I choose to stay. To retain my freedom I will also not hold anyone accountable should my decision result in personal injury to myself from my choice.

I figure if our government and courts can ignore laws like immigration and the many others they do it's good enough for me as well. I was born free with free will and I'll die the same way.
- Deb, Derry

While I have only the highest regard and respect for Professional Firefighters, one aspect of this issue that complicates things a bit is that many New Hampshire towns have non-professional / volunteer firefighters that just are not required to be trained and certified to the level of knowledge, skills, abilities and training of full time paid professional firefighters. Not sure it makes sense to have a lesser trained, less knowledgeable person making such critical decisions for us on whether to evacuate or shelter in place if we choose.
- Steve, Derry

If emergency personnel tell you to leave you should listen. If you do not listen you better not be the first one to complain when they are delayed in a rescue attempt.
- Jamie, New Hampton

I didn't call for help, I know my home & area very well, 30+ yrs living in this house on this street, 60 yrs living in this area. I hold myself responsible for any & all discision that I make. I do not expect anyone to risk their own life for me. I stated that! As far as my dog, she is a 10+ yr old, 100 lb +/- of Dobbie / Rottie cross that I have had since she was 4 weeks old, she was bottled fed, very protective went need be. NOW tell me that I am not a responsible for my own well being or that of my beloved pet in any and all discision that I make.
- EVY, the arrested person, ALLENSTOWN, NH

To Alex from Nashua You have the right to stand out in the lightning storm for as long as you like. But do you have the right to make a rescuer go out in that same lightning storm to pick you up off your front lawn after you are struck and your wife or children find you lying lifeless. The fire department has only the best interests of the citizens they are sworn to protect at heart. Sometimes that means protecting them from themselves. As a firefighter for twenty years I assure you that if at all possible we will get you and your pets out of harms way with as little inconvenience as possible. But you have to help us do our jobs.You have to remember that in an emergency situation like they are talking about, you are probably not the only person in need of help. In my career I've pulled many pets out of burning buildings just as I would a person so I do understand how people feel about their animals. People in public safety are not interested in the politics they are interested in public safety. We are there to help and will continue to do so,but we can't do it without the cooperation of the citizens whose safety we are entrusted with.
- Mark, Manchester

D.L., they shut off your power? Say it ain't so? They should have left the electricity on. Sure, they would have been risking people's lives with flooded ground transformers and potential wires down into the flood waters, but hey, at least your meatloaf wouldn't spoil, right?

Oh yeah, you only had a few inches of water. And how fast did the water rise in Alstead, killing those people? Good choice, staying put.
- Ralph, Madison

This is disturbing to me as someone who lives in a house at the edge of a Keene neighborhood that flooded in Oct. 2005. My basement had a few inches of flood water but that was not any sort of real emergency in comparison to those who lived at the deeper end of the flooded area where cars were flooded to their roofs. However, we were asked to leave our home but we did not because we weren't really flooded. We had our sump pumps running and taking care of the inconvenient inches in the basement. Then, the National Guard arrived and actually set up their command center on our front yard (dry) and asked us to evacuate. Not a chance! And then worst of all, they shut the power off to our neighborhood (even those not flooded) which prevented our sump pumps from operating. So... we had to go find a generator to keep the pumps running and our refrigerated perishables from rotting. Luckily, the generator and fuel were delivered by family. We spent a couple of days and nights without electricity in our home but we felt it would have been ridiculous to move our family of 5 out of the house since we were not actually flooded. With this ruling we probably would have been arrested. What this has taught me is that if it happens again (heaven forbid) then we'll just hide out in the house and keep a low profile until it passes.
- DL, Keene

If I didn't want to leave my house and it was only MY life in danger then I should be allowed to stay.

I would have to say if it ever comes to this situation with myself being involved, I promise it would come to gunfire before I left under arrest.
- Jeff, Manchester

Mike P & Dave;

You don't get it, the SC didn't rule arrows weren't deadly. they ruled the law didn't cover them - yet. Big difference.
- JoJo, Hudson

To Jose and Dan:

Most emergency personnel would gladly risk their lives to save another. In fact, that is the sort of behavior we, the public, have come to expect from them. However, asking someone to risk their life for a dog, cat, turtle or any other family pet is ludicrous. I have 2 dogs that I love dearly. However, they ARE NOT PEOPLE. They do not have the same status as my wife or children. And no, I would not expect anyone to put their life in danger for my dogs.

Quite frankly, I don't care how much you love your dog. It is still JUST A DOG. And putting someone at risk for your dog is selfish. This lady should have been left to fend for herself and her precious dog!!!
- Mark, Bedford

What's being glossed over is whether is was a life threatening situation or not. The court took a seemingly simple minded approach by looking up the word emergency in their dictionary, saw the word flood, and decided yup a flood is an emergency. But not all floods result in injury or death.

It's easy to assume the rescue people are trained to assess the situation, but what about people who have experienced prior floods on their own property and have a better understanding if it is truly dangerous or not. It's not too far fetched to believe the property owner can assess the situation more accurately than personnel arriving on the scene who are unfamiliar with the area.

I do agree that if they refuse help, that they are on their own and the rescue folks shouldn't be obligated to return later.
- Tom, Portsmouth

So.. if I respond in the ambulance to you having chest pain, for which could cause your death, should you be hand cuffed to go to the hospital so I don't have to come back later and do CPR if you refuse my treatment? What is the difference.. how far are we to hold peoples hands.
- Jack, allenstown

What's really sad here is that this seems to be a case of not treating a human like a human.

This is a very tough issue. I see both sides of it. I do believe that a person's private property is sacred ground, and no one should be able to force a person off of their own property. At the same time, responders are forced to respond if the person who refused to evacuate later finds themself in a life or death situation.

It's not easily possible to allow people to refuse to evacuate and then keep a list of those people and treat them differently until the emercency for which the evacuation was ordered is over. This would require systems and resources that are not in place. While I like the idea of allowing refusal of evacuation, but charging those who refused for any emergency services they later require because of their decision, there is a problem: it's not just about money, but also about available resources. It's hard to justify running into a situation where someone who has not refused an evacuation does not get the emergency help they need quickly enough because emergency resources are tied up rescuing someone who refused an evactuation. No amount of billing after the fact could make up for this.

Rick T and Mark, a dog is a family member for most owners. Dogs have unique personalities, just as humans do, and they cannot be replaced at any cost. Just because they're not the same species as us and don't live as long as us doesn't mean they're disposable. While I'd never expect anyone to risk their life for a dog, I would indeed risk my own life for my dog without hesitation.

Evy - kudos to you for standing up for what you believe. Hopefully even the people here who are being critical of you can at least give you credit for your integrity. Well done!
- Jose H, Manchester, NH

Dave(Franklin), thank you for recognizing such a 'beautiful mind' and offering your views in such a cute manner. Too cute, by half, as it turns out.

Tell us, Dave, what would you estimate the effective range of a hammer and nail to be? For the sake of arguement, let's agree that a ninja like person, armed with hammer and nail, could kill a person within a 20 ft. circle.
Now, Dave, what effective range would an arrow, shot from a bow, have. Would you agree that it is a damn sight more than 20 ft?
A disturbed felon, armed with a bow and arrows, could easily kill a neighbor who was mowing their lawn, simply by opening the window.
Dave, do you honestly believe the same could be said if he was armed with a hammer and nail? Please.

Yes, I am a deadly weapon. Very much so, when need be. Thankfully, given that I am a "sharp individual", my best weapon is my mind. It keeps me out of situations that would require the use of deadly force.
- Mike P., Manchester

You should be able to stay in your own home. Maybe you sign a release stating that you understand the risks and that emergency services may not be able to help/reach you for an extended period of time.
- Tim, Merrimack

To Mark (Bedford) & Rick T (Manch):

You guys don't get it. To many people, a dog is not simply "stuff", it is a family member. Just because you don't see dogs the same as Evy (and others) do, don't tell her what she should and should not value in her life.

More fundamentally, if a person wishes to ignore an evacuation order at his/her own peril, then that's their prerogative. Through this refusal, let them waive the right/privelege to subsequent rescue and prevent undue risk to others.
- Dan, Auburn

If you people want the right to stay in your homes despite the warning of professionals, then you should forego the right to call for help. Nobody should have to risk their life to save someone who is too stupid to listen to the warnings.

Sometimes our government must make laws to protect people who are too stupid to protect themselves.

I hope that every police officer thinks of this decision before risking their lives for some ungrateful, ignorant, person.
- claire, manchester

The second article of the NH state Constitution grants us the inherent right to possess and protect property. Tell the fire chief that you're attempting to protect your home and he will have no authority to make demands. The Constitution trumps all other laws.

I don't care about the "common sense" opinion in some of the replies. Common sense says that if I want to stand outside in the open during a lightening storm, that's my right as a free human being. Anything to the contrary means that we are not free. You can't allow the government to chip away at freedom, no matter how sensible it may seem. Protecting our civil liberties is more important.
- Alex, Nashua, NH

I agree with Kittae, Manchester, NH. You can stay if you want but do not expect to be rescued later.

But did they really hand-cuff her and then put her in a boat? That's more dangerous than spending the night on your roof.
- Todd, New London

This ruling only addresses the idea that when given a lawful order to evacuate then you need to get out, not try and get your dog. Evacuations are very detailed and need to be done in a quick fashion, Evy do you not remember elementary school where when the alarm went off you left and did not try to grab extra stuff.

I am sorry that your dog could have been hurt but if we are living in a realistic world animals and things can be replaced. Your refusal to leave put innocent people (police and fire) in an awkward position and possibly dangerous position. If your facts as you stated on this post are true then I doubt you will be in any trouble beyond going through a trial.
- Rick T, Manchester

put me on the 'do not respond' list.
- j, manch

Evy,

I support your decisions and I'm disappointed with the ruling. There were many people who were forced out of their homes during Katrina who were in no significant threat, had plenty of canned food to survive, generators, and everything they needed. These people had to leave or face being arrested because some "rescue worker" thought they were in danger. Sure just leave and have your house ransacked by looters even though you are safe, this worker _must_ know what he is talking about.

And to you Steve from Concord, don't come hear talking about stubbornness when you comment is just as one-sided. Who says these emergency personnel are making all the right decisions. Maybe I don't want your help. Put me on the do not respond list, that's just fine. This doesn't mean, however, that I should not qualify for reconstruction grants since me being in my house has no effect on whether or not the house is destroyed. This is common sense, no?
- Benjamin, Bedfprd

I am all for people not being forced from their homes. As long as they are aware THERE WILL BE NO CALLING 911 AND EXPECTING SENSIBLE PEOPLE TO RISK THEIR LIVES TO SAVE THEM. You want to stay, you stay alone. No whining later on that you didn't think it was that serious - do you think they call for an evacuation because someone thought it would be fun?!?!
- Kittae, Manchester, NH

Well, we have heard from the actual defendant, a person, who outside of this incident, is an otherwise law-abiding citizen. I see no reason to doubt what she tells us. If all that she says is true and accurate (and again, there is no reason to disbelieve her) then I think the state has found itself utilizing resources it should not.

Steve in Concord, people like you tick me off. I personally find nothing more distateful than a self-serving "public safety person" who is so full of him or herself with that power-grabbing, elitist mentality.

Thankfully, the majority of public safety officials properly view their roles as such and people like Steve in Concord are not in charge.
- Rick Olson, Manchester

Evy, a dog? You continued to jeopardize the lives and safety of the people who came to rescue you OVER A DOG???!!!! What would you be saying on this post if a rescuer had drown while waiting for YOUR DOG????

"Gee, Mrs. So-and-so, I'm sorry your husband and father of your children was killed during a rescue attempt, but I just couldn't leave without little Fifi." Selfish. Absolutely selfish.
- Mark, Bedford

First of all, I am Evy Bernard, I did get arrested because I would not leave with out my dog who was sitting in my jeep. The Police officer stated he didn't have the time to argue about a dog. YES, I stated "You will have to arrest me, BECASUE I was not leaving without my dog."
You people, Who are hanging me out to dry have not gotten the whole story or how it was played out. There are alot of facts that was not told in this story. When it comes down to the bottom line, I didn't not break the law in any way. But the fact are not written in this story. The court only heard a very small part of what happened at my home on Riverside Dr in Allenstown, NH in April 07.
- Evy,, Allenstown, nh

I think that if a mandatory evacuation is given and the occupants do not wish to leave their structures (barring a medical condition where it would be more suitable to leave them in place) then emergency services should not use the time and resources to go and force them out. However if an emergency does arise, and the occupants were told to vacate and they decided not to, then the occupants should be charged by the town for the cost of rescuing them. This way if you feel it is your right to stay in your homes, but then request the assistance of the town to rescue you post evacuation order, you are held liable to the costs.
- Kyle, Manchester

If someone is stupid enough to stay in their home, they should have that right. Then emergency personnel should inform them that no one will come to save them under any circumstances.
- Kevin C, Nashua

I agree....you should have the right to exercise exceptionally poor judgement and stay in your home. HOWEVER, I believe the law should be revised in the following manner:
If a person refuses to leave, after being ordered to do so by fire, police or other emergency personnel, that person is NO LONGER ENTITLED TO ANY RESCUE SERVICES. That address will be added to a list of "Do Not Respond" sites. Furthermore, they also waive any claim to ANY disaster relief funds distributed by Federal, State or Local agencies. Long story short: If you want to stay in an emergency, you agree to be totally ON YOUR OWN!
- Mark, Bedford

This is a sad ruling. Unfortunately, with the nanny staters having a majority in Concord, I doubt it'll get addressed.
- Alan, Haverhill

So, during an emergency, the police thought they should arrest a woman who had already agreed to leave her home instead of dedicating their limited resources to more pressing matters? Cool.
- Michael, Derry

You people just do NOT GET IT! Here it is in a nutshell. COMMON sense needs to prevail. As a public safety employee I must take great issue with your stubborn stance on staying put when common sense says.. get out. I will tell you what will then happen... you will for help when the situation is dire.. and then I will put myself or one of my personnel at great personal peril to save your stubborn live free or die butt! You need to have some common sense and stop being so pig headed and stubborn and putting the lives of the rescuers at risk when it was not necessary. That is why the law to order an evacuation exists.. to keep every one safe. You may not like it, to bad! I want to send my people home to their loved ones after an emergency. Not to attend a funeral for them if they died trying to save your stubborn butt
- Steve, Concord

I think you should be able to stay if you want, and you should be able to "Live Free AND Die", but don't call for help and expect it to come after you have failed to leave. Please, decrease the surplus population.
- Texter, Newfields

Though its true you have the right to stay in your home during an emergency, what happens when your life becomes endangered and you decide to call for help. Now you are putting rescue workers in unneccessary danger to help when you could have left . Also you could be taken the manpower and resources that could be needed to help someone who isn't able to leave on their own. It's not a government plot, it's common sense>
- Mark, Manchester

What I took that to read, and correct me if Im wrong, is that the fire dept as the right to tell people to vacate, but no where in there did it say it was against the law for people to not evacuate. If people dont want to leave their homes during a flood, dont make them. If they dont want to listen to the govt branch who is trying to help them, dont. But then these same people shouldnt be allowed to ask for any grants or govt money to rebuild their homes either. Like Louisiana.. people shouldve got on the bus that was offered. Those who didnt, reaped what they sewed.
- Theresa, Dover NH

Nobody has the right to order you out of your home or off your property. That right is protected by Article 19 of the NH Constitution and the 4th and 14th Ammendment of the U.S. Constitution and can not be changed by any law.

Anyone coming onto my land to order me off better be carrying a loaded weapon.
- Bill, Tuftonboro

The question becomes one of who has a right to decide what constitutes an emergency sufficient to justify this action. Personally speaking, I do not want anyone on my property without my knowledge or acceptance. Any attempt to remove me from my property against my will is a threat to my privacy and freedom. I will gladly sign a liability waiver with the State of NH.
- JB, NB, NH

I believe the point of this was not to keep you out of your home in smaller cases of medical emergencies but rather in a state emergency where your life and the lives of others are in jeopardy. If people are being told to evacuate and it’s mandatory it is not only for your wellbeing but those of the people that are volunteering or working for the rescue services.
In the case of the hurricane in Texas this past yr where people refused to leave and were told that emergency personal would not go and assist them. Many people lost their lives because they refused to leave their homes. I feel for people that don’t want to leave but your life is more important and I would like to believe that is what the final decision was based on, keeping us out of our own way. Arresting someone may be the only way to save their life.
- Leah, Manchester

Mike P from Manchester, kudos to you for hitting the nail right on the freakin' head. Wait a minute, a hammer, a nail, both deadly weapons. You are one sharp individual. Hey, are you a deadly weapon??
- Dave, Franklin

Quit whining! Emergency services personnel have a tough enough job to do daily, and more so in an emergency.
The folks who are complaining about the government's actions - as if it were some ominous plot, would line up to sue the Town and its oficials for failing to act if those idiots were left on their own as the water flushed them away!
- Jim, Manchester

Notice how the intent of the court's ruling will now subject those citizens that may be suffering at home from a variety of medical ailments to comply with what could be a misjudgement of the fire department; many of which manage the medical services for NH's communities?

Can you imagine caring for your sick dependent at home and being second guessed by a fire chief that has no medical qualifications and no parenting skills, and yet can have you arrested if you dare to say "no"?

The Legislature must change this law!
- NickySaints, Milford NH

The Allenstown Police won this battle but they are losing the hearts and minds of the townspeople.

The arrest itself and the flooding of her home is enough of a punishment. You've made your point. It is time to let this go.
- Mike, Allenstown

I agree with John. I should have the right to stay in my home no matter what. The government should not be able to determine what is best for me or my family.

It is just to much of a slippery slope.
- Doug Hogue, Merrimack

Isn't this the same Supreme Court that just discovered that arrows, shot from bows, can't be considered deadly weapons?

Are we horrified yet? We should be.
- Mike P., Manchester

This statute is driven solely by the threat of lawsuits and it's ridiculous. If people want to stay in their house during an emergency, that's not the government's concern.
- Frank, Derry, NH

So much for "Live free Or Die"
- Paul, manchester

What a waste of time and money - I want the right to say in my home no matter what.

Katherine Rogers must not have any other worthwhile people to harass.
- John, Manchester